[MGSA-L] Syriza vs. Xrisi Aygi column Του Νικου Χρυσολωρα

Fri Oct 5 01:55:37 PDT 2012

Two points on the remarks below:

1. As I have understood it as a member of MGSA on- and off for two or more decades, and a subscriber to this list nearly since its inception, ad hominem remarks have no place here, however couched the remarks below inappropriate as they could be interpreted as demeaning (whatever their "Classical" cover). That is the stuff for defamation and libel actions, to which I referred in a previous posting.

2. In fact Mr Grammenos reported as an eyewitness to a particular event, in other words he provided us with one piece of evidence about the situation in Greece; many of us understand scholarship to include the proper recording of evidence and its subsequent interpretation. Much more of this basic recording of evidence work is necessary as relates to the situation in Greece...  

As I understand what Mr Grammenos reported, the high school students sang a song that culminated in the threat of the use of violence (molotov cocktails and explosives). The recent thread in our list to which he referred touched on exactly that point, allegations about the use of violence by Chryse Auge over the last few months, and by the Anarcho-Leftists (including by factions of Syriza) over the last few years.

It would seem to me that a discussion about the loss of legitimacy by the major parties in Greece, the evolution of political activity towards the extremes of left and right, the readiness to use violence (and to ally with organized criminal groups [such as drug dealers and human traffickers], to give cover to foreign extremists and maintain links with Hezbollah and similar groups), all are (related) subjects which should be at the very heart of the discussions and the necessary scholarly work by members of our association.

Aristide Caratzas

On Oct 5, 2012, at 4:05 AM, Neni Panourgia wrote:

> Indeed, Mr Grammenos, indeed, many of those who speak and write about Greece, know nothing about Greece. Perfect self-awareness. You would have made Socrates happy, indeed.
> 
>> many of those who speak and write about Greece, know nothing about Greece.
>> 
> 
> np/
> 
> On 10/3/2012 8:08 PM, athanasios grammenos wrote:
>> Some 150 students of a North Attica High School, protested today outside the Town Hall of their Municipality. The reason was a problem with the transportation of the students across the region, because of the budget. They went there, despite the fact that the responsible is the Regional Director and not the Mayor. 
>> 
>> However, the most interesting, is what I witnessed that they were singing. It was irrelevant to their main cause but it symbolized something related to the conversation about SYRIZA and Golden Dawn. 
>> 
>> Here it is:
>> Ψωμί-παιδεία-ελευθερία (bread-education-liberty)
>> πουλήστε τα γραφεία σας να πάρουμε βιβλία (sell your offices and let us buy books)
>> 
>> πάρτε το χαμπάρι δεν φεύγουμε απο δω (get it, we're going nowhere)
>> θα κανουμ' ανω-κάτω το δημαρχείο αυτό (we'll do a mess to this Town Hall)
>> 
>> το μέλλον μας δεν είναι τα ναρκωτικά (drugs is not our future)
>> είναι οι μολότωφ και τα εκρηκτικά. (our future is molotov [bombs] and explosives)
>> 
>> Unfortunately, many of those who speak and write about Greece, know nothing about Greece.
>> 
>> AG
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2012/9/30 Christos D. Katsetos <cd_katsetos at yahoo.com>
>> In his circuitous, overly didactic, and hubris-laden posts, Dr Nikos Chrysoloras,
>> journalist and EU correspondent of the Athens daily "Kathimerini," is going off on 
>> tangents, effectively avoiding direct confrontation of the main issue at hand, which
>> is the legitimacy of dissent in the Greek political system.
>>    
>> At issue is the journalist's statement that "both SYRIZA and Chrissi Avgi's populist 
>> discourses question the legitimacy of democratically elected governments." 
>> Here the legitimacy of dissenting opinion is replaced by the embellished phrase 
>> "populist discourses [which] question the legitimacy of democratically elected 
>> governments." The author is using Laclau's analysis of the logic of equivalence 
>> operative in populist demands to justify his assertion that Golden Dawn and the 
>> Coalition of the Radical Left party (SYRIZA) are structurally "equivalent" (insinuating
>> that the convergence of BOTH extreme parties is threatening Greek democracy). 
>> 
>> As such, the militancy of the extreme right, which promotes hate mongering and 
>> perverts traditional Greek patriotism, is put on the same footing as the social and 
>> human rights activism embraced by the leftist SYRIZA party. In my view, this is a 
>> deliberate and self-serving linkage distortion. It is apparent that the journalist's mission
>> is to nullify the legitimacy of principled dissent expressed by political forces that
>> oppose the austerity measures and want to re-negotiate the terms of Greece's bailout package. Arguably, the primary target here is not the ultranationalist party but the
>> Coalition of the Radical Left party (SYRIZA) that has the potential of governing the
>> country in the not too distant future.  
>> 
>> What we are witnessing in the Greek mass media nowadays is the emergence 
>> of certain aspiring pundits with academic credentials, some of whom are running
>> regular columns in certain influential newspapers, who are getting away with 
>> provocative and outrageous statements by adopting an arrogant style of analysis 
>> based on the framework and communication strategies dictated by political 
>> expedience. 
>> 
>> This confrontational approach only serves to further disenfranchise a growing 
>> segment of the population, deepen divisions in the Greek society, and create 
>> the conditions for the revival of a bitter and potentially violent civil conflict. 
>> 
>> And yet, a growing number of Greeks (without Left-wing affiliations) are opposed
>> to this divisive rhetoric and believe that Greece's path to recovery will be achieved 
>> only through national unity and reconciliation. 
>> 
>> -- See Prof Sir Basil Markesinis' interview aired on ET3 (Greek Public Television)
>> on May 2, 2012  http://vimeo.com/41375667
>>  
>> -- See Prof Markesinis' latest call for National Reconciliation.  
>> http://www.antibaro.gr/article/5460
>> 
>>   
>> Christos D. Katsetos, MD, PhD, FRCPath
>> http://www.drexelmed.edu/Home/AboutOurFaculty/ChristosKatsetos.aspx
>> http://www.stchristophershospital.com/find-a-physician/120
>> From: Nikos Chrysoloras <nikos.chrysoloras at gmail.com>
>> To: mgsa-l at uci.edu 
>> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2012 4:20 AM
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [MGSA-L] Syriza vs. Xrisi Aygi column Του Νικου Χρυσολωρα
>> 
>> http://maillists.uci.edu/mailman/public/mgsa-l/2012-September/014432.html
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> -- --
>> And if you find her poor, Ithaka won’t have fooled you.
>> Wise as you will have become, so full of experience,
>> you will have understood by then what these Ithakas mean. 
>> 
>> Constantine Cavafy
>> 
>> «Εσμέν Έλληνες το γένος, ως η τε φωνή και η πάτριος παιδεία μαρτυρεί»
>> Πλήθων Γεμιστός
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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> 
> -- 
> ________________________
> Professor Neni Panourgiá
> 
> 2012-2013
> Visiting Associate Professor
> Bard College
> Anthropology Department 
> Hopson 301
> Warden's Hall, PO Box 5000
> Annandale-on-Hudson, NY 12504
> (845) 752-7217
> 
> ICLS
> Heyman Center for the Humanities, 
> Columbia University, 
> New York, NY 10027
> 
> Dangerous Citizens. The Greek Left and the Terror of the State
> www.dangerouscitizens.columbia.edu
> 
> Ethnographica Moralia Experiments in Interpretive Anthropology
> www.fordhampress.com/detail.html?id=9780823228874
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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Aristide D. Caratzas
Telephone: 30-697-228-5442
acaratzas at gmail.com

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